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Osvald
Vientiane
19 Posts |
 Posted - 01/04/2008 : 05:24:55
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Greetings. Wonder if anyone had any experience with working for an intl organisation (NATO, the UN, OSCE) outside Canada and its implications to maintaining Canadian residency status.
My immediate concern is that, since immigrating to Canada as a federal skilled worker, Ive spent quite some time working for the UN overseas and have been approaching the 3-in-5 yrs ceiling. Wonder if any of time spent with an int'l agency where Canada is a member would count for the purposes of maintaining PR in Canada (it does not counts towards naturalization, of course, but thats no matter of concern for the time being)
The current IRPA and the Regulations eg
<http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/enf/enf23e.pdf> spell out the usual exemptions (being overseas with a canadian spouse, working for a canadian agency or business etc) but does not refer to working for intl organisations. However, there is an enigmatic reference to 'regulations providing for other means of compliance' (p10); I wonder if this would cover working for the UN.
I mentioned the issue to a friendly Immigration Counsellor at the Canadian embassy; he thought the issue was too complex and forwarden an inquiry to cic ottawa; but we havent heared from them since.
Grateful for any info about your experience and helpful precedents
Continued success!
osvald
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sarajevo
sarajevo
15 Posts |
Posted - 01/04/2008 : 15:13:42
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hi Osvald
I had a same question for CIC and answer is that while working for UN my status of permanent resident is not in question. That means that all days spent as UN worker are counted toward retention of PR status but not counted toward citizenship requirements.
Than, I asked is there any official document to confirm her statement she said she does not know. That is problematic....well to risky...can you imagine to appear on canadian border and be refused entry as you did nit spent 720 in 5 years as PR in the country....I refused two assigments because of insecurity...
sarajevo
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Osvald
Vientiane
19 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2008 : 03:30:51
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Hi Sarajevo
Many thanks, this is very encouraging news. Ideally, getting a written opinion from the CIC would be the best option. Will try approaching them once Im back in Canada in March. If it works out, will post an update
Thanks and cheers
osvald
quote:
hi Osvald
I had a same question for CIC and answer is that while working for UN my status of permanent resident is not in question. That means that all days spent as UN worker are counted toward retention of PR status but not counted toward citizenship requirements.
Than, I asked is there any official document to confirm her statement she said she does not know. That is problematic....well to risky...can you imagine to appear on canadian border and be refused entry as you did nit spent 720 in 5 years as PR in the country....I refused two assigments because of insecurity...
sarajevo
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PMM
Vancouver
1590 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2008 : 21:55:22
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Hi
quote:
Hi Sarajevo
Many thanks, this is very encouraging news. Ideally, getting a written opinion from the CIC would be the best option. Will try approaching them once Im back in Canada in March. If it works out, will post an update
Thanks and cheers
osvald
quote:
hi Osvald
I had a same question for CIC and answer is that while working for UN my status of permanent resident is not in question. That means that all days spent as UN worker are counted toward retention of PR status but not counted toward citizenship requirements.
Than, I asked is there any official document to confirm her statement she said she does not know. That is problematic....well to risky...can you imagine to appear on canadian border and be refused entry as you did nit spent 720 in 5 years as PR in the country....I refused two assigments because of insecurity...
sarajevo
I think you better think about the information your were given. The only way to maintain your PR status outside Canada, is:
• accompanying abroad (that is, ordinarily residing with) a spouse or common-law partner or
parent who is a Canadian citizen;
• being employed abroad, on a full-time basis, by a prescribed Canadian business or in the
public service of Canada or of a province; or
• accompanying abroad (that is, ordinarily residing with) a Canadian permanent resident spouse or common-law partner or parent who is also outside Canada and who is employed,
on a full-time basis, by a prescribed Canadian business or in the public service of Canada or of a province.
As Osvald stated the UN does not fall into the above categories. The operative section is 28(2) of the Act.
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(a) a permanent resident complies with the residency obligation with respect to a five-year period if, on each of a total of at least 730 days in that five-year period, they are
(i) physically present in Canada,
(ii) outside Canada accompanying a Canadian citizen who is their spouse or common-law partner or, in the case of a child, their parent,
(iii) outside Canada employed on a full-time basis by a Canadian business or in the federal public administration or the public service of a province,
(iv) outside Canada accompanying a permanent resident who is their spouse or common-law partner or, in the case of a child, their parent and who is employed on a full-time basis by a Canadian business or in the federal public administration or the public service of a province, or
(v) referred to in regulations providing for other means of compliance;
There are no other means stated in the Regulation.
PMM
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Osvald
Vientiane
19 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2008 : 00:44:55
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Many thanks, PMM. Yes, this is a good point, this situation is not speleld out in the law or regulations which leaves lots of ambiguity. Once Im back in Canada, will see if theres any chance getting the CIC's written opinion on this; would be also helpful to other colleagues resident in Canada in the future.
There appears to be anecdotary evidence that even if an imm officer at the port of entry would initiate action re: the loss of PR status, during the appeal hearing the tribunal would accept time spent with intl agencies where Canada is a member as legitimate time for maintaining PR in Canada. All the same, its a big nuisance and potential risk.
Most other developed countries (Australia, the UK, US, New Zealand) have an explicit rule that working for intl agencies would not jepardise ones PR status. Im quite puzzled why Canada, a nation active on the int'l scene, never addressed this issue in its imm rules explicitly
Regards and cheers
osvald
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sarajevo
sarajevo
15 Posts |
Posted - 01/07/2008 : 23:26:17
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excellent point.
But it is very difficult and risky to play with your /mine PR status and to depend of the opinion of the officer on the port of entry. I do not think that CIC gives the written opinions regarding the matter but excellent point is that one who works for UN agency acctually works for the organisation that Canada has an direct involvment . it is the strong argument for the court but do we really wish to end up proving the things that are not mentioned by positive legislation?
where are you based with your UN assigment?
Kind regards and hope to clarify the matter one for all of us. I have refused ( I have been forced to refuse due to my dillema and related insecurity)the assigments and now I am sitting and waiting for the passport to arrive as I do not want to put my status under the risk......
Regards to you and to PMM
sarajevo
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awdhesbhumihar
EDISON
1 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2008 : 13:41:32
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Dear Osvald I am also sailing in the same boat, please update this forum when ever you have any new info.I am working with UN in NY.
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Osvald
Vientiane
19 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2008 : 03:28:55
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Greetings. The results of my further research havent been terribly encouraging. As the Regulations contain no provisions about Canadian residence for the staff if intl organisations, they would be generally treated as any other permanent residents. Ie, if one had spent more than 3 yrs out of 5 abroad, the Canadian immigration official at the port of entry would use his discretion, but very likely would concude that residence lapsed.
The only consolation is, as quite a few immigration lawyers believed, if the overstay is not frightfully significant and an appeal is made, this would make a strong case with the immigration review tribunal, and residence is likely to be restored. Especially if one worked on Canadian-funded projects overseas. All the same, a hearing at the IRT is similar to going to court, likely to be a bore and major nuissance.
I also found out that the draft Regulations re: maintaining PR in Canada originally included a provision about intl organistion staff working abroad but it was deleted from the final version. So no attorney would be able to argue this is an ommission from the Regulations, it appears to be Canada's deliberate policy stance.
Should I get any better news, will post it
cheers
osvald
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Nban
Toronto in future
1 Posts |
Posted - 11/08/2009 : 18:17:52
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dear Osvald,
ANy news re this?
Best,
Nban
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